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amplificathonThere are several stories that I asked for permission to record, and even started to podfic, back before The Summer of WTF. (ie before the previous laptop expired, and my father died, and Bangkok went up in flames, with dramatic gunfights at the end of my road.) I still have this mental to-do list - which also includes going back to the Camelot/Torchwood fusion story I'd started writing - but I am also a flake, and avoidant, and heaven knows when/if this will happen. KL Morgan's lovely Labyrinth novel "A Forfeit of Dreams", which I'd been merrily podficcing, was completely lost - this is disheartening, since it is HUGE, but I will go back and start over eventually. I still haven't started on the J2 Jensen-stands-for-election story called, er, I forget what it's called, but it's very good, and West Wing flavoured, and I called dibs on it months ago and still haven't recorded it.
If someone else nipped in in the interim and wanted to podfic these (or, you know, anything else I'm recording/have recorded) I do believe I'd be perfectly sanguine about it, because (1) I might be finding it trickier to fit in the time/inclination to make the podfic after all, and be relieved that someone else is on the case, and (2) I do subscribe to the multiple-performances philosophy, as both a listener and a performer. Because different styles appeal to different listeners, so it seems a shame to say that, no, This Is The One True Version. That's the theoretical side of it; on a personal level, I podfic for completely selfish reasons, not out of some sense of service-to-the-community or whatever. I actively enjoy reading aloud, and getting to play different roles. It's fun. People want to play Hamlet because it's a brilliant role and exhilarating to perform, not because they think that all previous versions fucked it up, you know? And with covers of songs, it's because they think that they have something fresh to bring to it - or even just because it's a lovely song to sing, whether they're doing anything innovative or not? (I mean, I wander around singing absent-mindedly just because I love singing and it makes me happy, not because I think I can teach the ghost of Ella Fitzgerald a thing or two.)
So, anyway - that's what I think.
I am aware, though (argh - egotistical moment of ego) that I'm coming at this from the position of feeling confident in my own abilities in storytelling and acting. (Although not so much tech-fu - I'm very Luddite in the tech side of recording things.) I mean, I know my style isn't going to be everyone's cup of tea, but it's not something I feel insecure about. It lives in the Things I Can Do bit of my brain, along with drawing and writing. If we were talking about an endeavour in another field, in one of the MYRIAD Things I Feel Insecure About, then I'd be all "Oh, no, I'm crap at that, no, no, go ahead, wow, I suck, skillz, I haz none." So, er, I think podfic is one of a handful of areas where my ego is sufficiently healthy that I wouldn't take it as a personal dis if someone wanted to record something I'd recorded/something I was planning to record - I'd just think "Yes! It's a brilliant story, isn't it? I TOTALLY understand you wanting to record it!" Rather than thinking "Are you saying I suck? Oh, God, you're saying I suck! Argh! I suck!" (which would be my response in various other areas.)
(Actually, if you've got a more story-appropriate accent, I'd be actively delighted - I know I've gone ahead and recorded quite a lot of podfics for American fandoms, but I also think that it would be A Very Good Thing if those stories were recorded by proper Americans who can do the voices properly. Or, you know, anyone else - but especially then! PSA - I am totally good with people recording stories I've already recorded. Please don't feel that I've baggsied them and you can't do it now, if you're at all tempted.)
But having read Juice817's post a while back and listened to the ensuing discussions about multiplicity of versions, I know that this is something where people don't all feel like me. And I think we're moving into greater acceptance of Multiple Recordings (which I think is brilliant!) but I don't think it's become the accepted community norm or anything at this point.
There are several long-ass stories I've recorded that other people had called first dibs on - 'Defenders of the Realm' because I'd been an idiot and recorded it (for myself, mostly - I was still more in the podfic-for-my-own-use headspace, and less in the podfic-within-a-community-of-listeners-and-podficcers headspace) before getting permission, just because I was so in love with the story. When I belatedly realised that it had been called dibs on, I apologised and backed off, and was going to just keep it for my own enjoyment rather than releasing it into the wilds - but the podficcer in question very graciously said it was okay. Which was awesome - but it did mean that she then DIDN'T go ahead with recording it, and I can't know whether she genuinely felt sanguine about that, or whether I took something from her. Argh.
With 'The Incestuous Courtship of the Antichrist's Bride' I held off recording it for a couple of months, because I knew someone had already asked for permission to record it, but I kept going back to see the situation & eventually checked in with the podficcer in question, and she said RL had eaten her, and she was okay with me doing it (much as I would be with either of the long-ass podfics mentioned above, even though I like the stories tremendously).
Current iteration of this particular dilemma:
I idly read and loved a short story this week, and checked Jinjurly's archive to see if it had been done, and left a note asking if I could record it (having already recorded another short story by this author in this fandom earlier on, and enjoyed it greatly) - and then I went ahead and recorded it before going to bed that night. Because it would be fun to do, and to listen to - and it was, and it is. And that's mostly why I make podfics - I mean, I was making them for my own use merrily for at least a year here in Thailand when I didn't have an adequate internet connection to upload or download anything, and wasn't sharing them with anyone - it was just so I could enjoy listening to the stories I'd loved. I'm sort of a raised-by-wolves feral podficcer, really.
So in the space between asking for permission in the evening, and getting a reply the next day, I'd made the podfic - it's only forty minutes or so, so it probably took up an hour to do, or thereabouts.
But it turns out that somebody already called dibs on the story. This, as I said, is not the first time I've done this, let enthusiasm go scampering ahead of establishing whether someone else is already on the case - but it's a dick move, and I know it is. Even though I subscribe to the multiple recordings philosophy in principle, not everyone else does, and we're still in the process of establishing community norms - so in practice I think it's pretty dickish of me to be all "Aha! The story you were looking forward to recording! I have recorded it already!" ESPECIALLY when it's such a short story, recorded on a whim. Because, you know - there's no way of knowing how Other Podficcer feels about this, and it's more than likely that in PM-ing them thus I rain on their parade and they feel that they can't record it/they feel like I've just thrown a bucket of ice water over them. That's the rub.
::headdesk::
I have a feeling that the honourable course is probably to just stfu and let the other lass go ahead and do her thing. Which is what I've done.
otoh, I know that there are stories that I've called dibs on (such as those cited above) but which I've still not got around to recording, and I'd be totally cool with someone else jumping in and doing it. It's conceivable that the lady in question feels the same way. Or that she'd be okay with both of us releasing versions into the wild. But if I ask her, then it becomes difficult for her to say no, even if she wants to.
So, Obi-Wan-KePodficpeeps, what are YOUR feelings about podfic etiquette in cases such as this? Both in larger terms of Multiple Recordings, and then also terms of this specific case of having inadvertently recorded something before realising that someone else had called dibs?
How would you feel if someone PM-ed you to say that, er, they'd just recorded something you're working on? Would you go ahead with your project, or abandon it? Would you be okay with both releasing versions simultaneously, to make it into some kind of event? Would you feel okay about it so long as you were allowed to release your version first, and a week or a month or something went by before the other one were released into the aether? Would you make a small voodoo doll of Evil Podficcing Git In Question and stab it repeatedly, and rend your hair and gnash your teeth, and then politely say that it was all fine, whilst inwardly feeling furious/gutted? Would you prefer that they just stfu and let you get on with recording the story you'd called dibs on?
Where do you stand on the idea of calling dibs, and multiple recordings? And what do you think would be appropriate in this particular instance?
(crossposted from Podficmeta on DW)
If someone else nipped in in the interim and wanted to podfic these (or, you know, anything else I'm recording/have recorded) I do believe I'd be perfectly sanguine about it, because (1) I might be finding it trickier to fit in the time/inclination to make the podfic after all, and be relieved that someone else is on the case, and (2) I do subscribe to the multiple-performances philosophy, as both a listener and a performer. Because different styles appeal to different listeners, so it seems a shame to say that, no, This Is The One True Version. That's the theoretical side of it; on a personal level, I podfic for completely selfish reasons, not out of some sense of service-to-the-community or whatever. I actively enjoy reading aloud, and getting to play different roles. It's fun. People want to play Hamlet because it's a brilliant role and exhilarating to perform, not because they think that all previous versions fucked it up, you know? And with covers of songs, it's because they think that they have something fresh to bring to it - or even just because it's a lovely song to sing, whether they're doing anything innovative or not? (I mean, I wander around singing absent-mindedly just because I love singing and it makes me happy, not because I think I can teach the ghost of Ella Fitzgerald a thing or two.)
So, anyway - that's what I think.
I am aware, though (argh - egotistical moment of ego) that I'm coming at this from the position of feeling confident in my own abilities in storytelling and acting. (Although not so much tech-fu - I'm very Luddite in the tech side of recording things.) I mean, I know my style isn't going to be everyone's cup of tea, but it's not something I feel insecure about. It lives in the Things I Can Do bit of my brain, along with drawing and writing. If we were talking about an endeavour in another field, in one of the MYRIAD Things I Feel Insecure About, then I'd be all "Oh, no, I'm crap at that, no, no, go ahead, wow, I suck, skillz, I haz none." So, er, I think podfic is one of a handful of areas where my ego is sufficiently healthy that I wouldn't take it as a personal dis if someone wanted to record something I'd recorded/something I was planning to record - I'd just think "Yes! It's a brilliant story, isn't it? I TOTALLY understand you wanting to record it!" Rather than thinking "Are you saying I suck? Oh, God, you're saying I suck! Argh! I suck!" (which would be my response in various other areas.)
(Actually, if you've got a more story-appropriate accent, I'd be actively delighted - I know I've gone ahead and recorded quite a lot of podfics for American fandoms, but I also think that it would be A Very Good Thing if those stories were recorded by proper Americans who can do the voices properly. Or, you know, anyone else - but especially then! PSA - I am totally good with people recording stories I've already recorded. Please don't feel that I've baggsied them and you can't do it now, if you're at all tempted.)
But having read Juice817's post a while back and listened to the ensuing discussions about multiplicity of versions, I know that this is something where people don't all feel like me. And I think we're moving into greater acceptance of Multiple Recordings (which I think is brilliant!) but I don't think it's become the accepted community norm or anything at this point.
There are several long-ass stories I've recorded that other people had called first dibs on - 'Defenders of the Realm' because I'd been an idiot and recorded it (for myself, mostly - I was still more in the podfic-for-my-own-use headspace, and less in the podfic-within-a-community-of-listeners-and-podficcers headspace) before getting permission, just because I was so in love with the story. When I belatedly realised that it had been called dibs on, I apologised and backed off, and was going to just keep it for my own enjoyment rather than releasing it into the wilds - but the podficcer in question very graciously said it was okay. Which was awesome - but it did mean that she then DIDN'T go ahead with recording it, and I can't know whether she genuinely felt sanguine about that, or whether I took something from her. Argh.
With 'The Incestuous Courtship of the Antichrist's Bride' I held off recording it for a couple of months, because I knew someone had already asked for permission to record it, but I kept going back to see the situation & eventually checked in with the podficcer in question, and she said RL had eaten her, and she was okay with me doing it (much as I would be with either of the long-ass podfics mentioned above, even though I like the stories tremendously).
Current iteration of this particular dilemma:
I idly read and loved a short story this week, and checked Jinjurly's archive to see if it had been done, and left a note asking if I could record it (having already recorded another short story by this author in this fandom earlier on, and enjoyed it greatly) - and then I went ahead and recorded it before going to bed that night. Because it would be fun to do, and to listen to - and it was, and it is. And that's mostly why I make podfics - I mean, I was making them for my own use merrily for at least a year here in Thailand when I didn't have an adequate internet connection to upload or download anything, and wasn't sharing them with anyone - it was just so I could enjoy listening to the stories I'd loved. I'm sort of a raised-by-wolves feral podficcer, really.
So in the space between asking for permission in the evening, and getting a reply the next day, I'd made the podfic - it's only forty minutes or so, so it probably took up an hour to do, or thereabouts.
But it turns out that somebody already called dibs on the story. This, as I said, is not the first time I've done this, let enthusiasm go scampering ahead of establishing whether someone else is already on the case - but it's a dick move, and I know it is. Even though I subscribe to the multiple recordings philosophy in principle, not everyone else does, and we're still in the process of establishing community norms - so in practice I think it's pretty dickish of me to be all "Aha! The story you were looking forward to recording! I have recorded it already!" ESPECIALLY when it's such a short story, recorded on a whim. Because, you know - there's no way of knowing how Other Podficcer feels about this, and it's more than likely that in PM-ing them thus I rain on their parade and they feel that they can't record it/they feel like I've just thrown a bucket of ice water over them. That's the rub.
::headdesk::
I have a feeling that the honourable course is probably to just stfu and let the other lass go ahead and do her thing. Which is what I've done.
otoh, I know that there are stories that I've called dibs on (such as those cited above) but which I've still not got around to recording, and I'd be totally cool with someone else jumping in and doing it. It's conceivable that the lady in question feels the same way. Or that she'd be okay with both of us releasing versions into the wild. But if I ask her, then it becomes difficult for her to say no, even if she wants to.
So, Obi-Wan-KePodficpeeps, what are YOUR feelings about podfic etiquette in cases such as this? Both in larger terms of Multiple Recordings, and then also terms of this specific case of having inadvertently recorded something before realising that someone else had called dibs?
How would you feel if someone PM-ed you to say that, er, they'd just recorded something you're working on? Would you go ahead with your project, or abandon it? Would you be okay with both releasing versions simultaneously, to make it into some kind of event? Would you feel okay about it so long as you were allowed to release your version first, and a week or a month or something went by before the other one were released into the aether? Would you make a small voodoo doll of Evil Podficcing Git In Question and stab it repeatedly, and rend your hair and gnash your teeth, and then politely say that it was all fine, whilst inwardly feeling furious/gutted? Would you prefer that they just stfu and let you get on with recording the story you'd called dibs on?
Where do you stand on the idea of calling dibs, and multiple recordings? And what do you think would be appropriate in this particular instance?
(crossposted from Podficmeta on DW)
(no subject)
Date: 2010-08-28 09:51 pm (UTC)to the dark sideon the matter of One True Recordings. Which isn't to say that I might not have a moment of THEY THINK I SUCK if someone else did something I had already done or had said I was going to do, but I find that the less time I have for podficcing, the more sanguine I have become about it and about fandom in general. What it really boils down to is, I'm here to have fun and not to create ~drama~ for myself or anyone else.I would prefer to be PM'd rather than to have a surprise posting of something I had done/was doing, and whether or not I would abandon one in progress would honestly depend on how much of the recording I had already done and how cramped for time I was at the moment. I think that as long as the author is okay with it or doesn't care either way, and as long as both podficcers are okay with it, multiple versions could be posted at the same time. I think the key is being honest, being able to say "I would rather you didn't post it (or posted it in a few weeks, or whatever)" if it's an issue, and have that be accepted with no hard feelings. Which may be easier said than done.
Just thinking aloud, not an attack on you
Date: 2010-08-29 09:08 am (UTC)I think the key is being honest, being able to say "I would rather you didn't post it (or posted it in a few weeks, or whatever)" if it's an issue, and have that be accepted with no hard feelings.
I can appreciate that, but I have to say that, if someone asked me not to post a podfic I had worked on, put myself into and that I was proud of (which goes for everything I create, because I don't record stories I don't love) they would be unlikely to get a polite response.
Re: Just thinking aloud, not an attack on you
Date: 2010-08-29 03:13 pm (UTC)if someone asked me not to post a podfic I had worked on... they would be unlikely to get a polite response.
I wouldn't like it either, and again, I was mostly addressing the situation
Re: Just thinking aloud, not an attack on you
Date: 2010-08-29 10:37 pm (UTC)Re: Just thinking aloud, not an attack on you
Date: 2010-08-30 04:47 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2010-08-29 01:06 pm (UTC)Dude, I'm so sorry to hear that! Because, honestly, I can't imagine that being the case, and I'm sorry you feel it might be. I mean, you're probably the most-lauded podficcer I can think of. People love what you do!
(no subject)
Date: 2010-08-29 03:17 pm (UTC)I'm getting better about it, though, and seeing so many people say they love multiple recordings and comparing it to song covers has really opened my eyes and helped me make it not about me.